Self-Assessment
I
have a lot of work to do. The goal that I want to accomplish more than
any other is to get conversationally fluent so that I can engage with
people without the usual starting and stopping. There are entire fields
of interest (i.e. music production) that I have no usable vocabulary
for.
One of the largest sources of misunderstanding comes from the classical Chinese references to literature and idioms.
The
eternal struggle is getting fluent now or seeing Mandarin as a
life-long pursuit (especially considering the extent of some of the
other goals in my life). Part of me wants to be successful and the other
part of me doesn't want to reach the goal too quickly.
It's
really strange being at this point in the Mandarin journey. It feels
like I am finished and at the same time like I haven't started. I am so
familiar with the language that sometimes I forget I am engaging with it
and other times I am completely lost and can't form the correct words
to speak. Sometime in the near future I am planning to sit down and
write out goals for where this journey will go next. I have filmed a
video for the fourth year and in the next day or so will film year five
but I think those videos won't be released until much later.
Study Habits
All of my 'studying' is at this point native exposure. I spend about two hours everyday watching TV with subtitles. During taxi/bus rides and during long runs I usually put on the local Xiamen radio station. My listening has, in my opinion, always been the weakest aspect of my Mandarin ability. When listening to the radio I usually listen for a few minutes at a time before my brain checks out. I let the mind wander for a few minutes and then return attention to the audio. In this way, it feels not quite as efficient as watching TV where you can listen and read for hours without fatigue.
Difficulties
A large part of my life is in English. I don't think that will ever change and I'm always trying to determine when/how/if Mandarin will ever be that important. It still hasn't risen above the level of a personal hobby and my progress feels like a clear reflection of that fact. Many of the goals that initially started me on this journey have already been completed and now I am working on maybe just one or two (i.e. reading Daoist literature, completing goals for completeness sake).
Follow along as I work my way to Mandarin fluency!
Monday, January 6, 2020
Year 4 and 5 Timeline Dump
I knew that at some point in my Mandarin journey I would get lazy enough that I'd probably forget to post here but I didn't think that it would happen so soon. The entries below are unedited (once again).
And at the same time, it’s always never enough. I can feel myself doing things I never thought I would be able to do but also frequently catch myself focusing solely on the things I can't do and still can't understand. Feeling like all the people that inspired me to start learning mandarin are still years ahead of where I am, despite watching them years and years ago.
3 Years 5 Months (Feb 2018)
2-4-2018:
Recently I’ve been learning lots of synonyms and filling out my native language abilities. It
makes it easier to improvise and also reinforces all the stuff I already
know
2-13-2018: My reading speed has increased dramatically as I get close to finishing the first of the three 三体 books. I went through grammar points on AllSetGrammar and was happily surprised to find that A1 and A2 and almost all of B1 Grammar is a piece of cake. It's weird looking at it and remembering when I was first starting out. It feels like a lifetime ago.
2-22-2018: Went looking for and found some great Mandarin grammar books from Routledge. My language ability has so much native exposure that reading and speaking is a completely different experience than when I first started. Sentences are now chunked into words and phrases just like in English which makes grasping and mastering a grammar concept quite easy if not natural. There are lots of little grammar mistakes I have been making for forever and I'm so happy to finally be able to get the kinks ironed out.
2-13-2018: My reading speed has increased dramatically as I get close to finishing the first of the three 三体 books. I went through grammar points on AllSetGrammar and was happily surprised to find that A1 and A2 and almost all of B1 Grammar is a piece of cake. It's weird looking at it and remembering when I was first starting out. It feels like a lifetime ago.
2-22-2018: Went looking for and found some great Mandarin grammar books from Routledge. My language ability has so much native exposure that reading and speaking is a completely different experience than when I first started. Sentences are now chunked into words and phrases just like in English which makes grasping and mastering a grammar concept quite easy if not natural. There are lots of little grammar mistakes I have been making for forever and I'm so happy to finally be able to get the kinks ironed out.
3 Years 7 Months (Apr 2018)
4-3-2018: I can't understand lots of things but at the same time I can understand everything. I was looking at the phone app, and remembering when I could barely navigate. I was reading a book on the bus in Chinese and despite large passages that make no sense, I could understand all the dialogue and main plot points. I can mostly follow along in Taichi class, and am now following two Chinese TV shows.
4-3-2018: I can't understand lots of things but at the same time I can understand everything. I was looking at the phone app, and remembering when I could barely navigate. I was reading a book on the bus in Chinese and despite large passages that make no sense, I could understand all the dialogue and main plot points. I can mostly follow along in Taichi class, and am now following two Chinese TV shows.
And at the same time, it’s always never enough. I can feel myself doing things I never thought I would be able to do but also frequently catch myself focusing solely on the things I can't do and still can't understand. Feeling like all the people that inspired me to start learning mandarin are still years ahead of where I am, despite watching them years and years ago.
3 Years 8 Months (May 2018)
5-28-2018: I started studying traditional characters recently and its really cool to finally understand all my Taiwan Facebook friend posts as well as texts from parents (they're all Taiwanese as well). I'm also using the opportunity to learn/review tones for all the 3000 most common Hanzi. Should help out a lot as I often don't know how to guess-pronounce new words when I see them in the wild.
I am continuing to practice Japanese. This has helped my pronunciation of Chinese and also keeps my knowledge of Chinese words fresh. My advancement in singing through my second passagio has also helped in making rising tones easier. My voice seems to tire less easily.
5-30-2018: When I practice Chinese on the Japanese deck, I often use Baidu translate to look up tone pairs that sound/feel funny when I pronounce them. Third tone and second tone still sound the same in a lot of places. I think I finally cleared up the difference between silent and third tone however. Also realizing that third tone is just flat low and not a dip when it is pronounced 99% of the time. I read this a long time ago but just starting re-realizing it.
5-28-2018: I started studying traditional characters recently and its really cool to finally understand all my Taiwan Facebook friend posts as well as texts from parents (they're all Taiwanese as well). I'm also using the opportunity to learn/review tones for all the 3000 most common Hanzi. Should help out a lot as I often don't know how to guess-pronounce new words when I see them in the wild.
I am continuing to practice Japanese. This has helped my pronunciation of Chinese and also keeps my knowledge of Chinese words fresh. My advancement in singing through my second passagio has also helped in making rising tones easier. My voice seems to tire less easily.
5-30-2018: When I practice Chinese on the Japanese deck, I often use Baidu translate to look up tone pairs that sound/feel funny when I pronounce them. Third tone and second tone still sound the same in a lot of places. I think I finally cleared up the difference between silent and third tone however. Also realizing that third tone is just flat low and not a dip when it is pronounced 99% of the time. I read this a long time ago but just starting re-realizing it.
3 Years 9 Months (Jun 2018)
6-4-2018: I've noticed that the only times I notice pronunciation is when I pronounce incorrectly. All the times I have great pronunciation or very clean pronunciation I don't pay attention at all. In order to stop that trend tonight I stopped and took note of how pronouncing 今天晚上 doesn't give me any problems at all. Not only that, but its sounds pretty good as well. Reminder to self: focus on the goals and the accomplishments in a balanced manner.
6-20-2018: Binge watched my first TV show in Chinese. I've also been going to Taiji every day and my brain is starting to produce mandarin quicker and more often than English. Often times the mandarin will pop into my head in the middle of an English sentence, sometimes before the English, and sometimes at the same time as the English. Very interesting.
3 Years 11 Months (Aug 2018)
6-4-2018: I've noticed that the only times I notice pronunciation is when I pronounce incorrectly. All the times I have great pronunciation or very clean pronunciation I don't pay attention at all. In order to stop that trend tonight I stopped and took note of how pronouncing 今天晚上 doesn't give me any problems at all. Not only that, but its sounds pretty good as well. Reminder to self: focus on the goals and the accomplishments in a balanced manner.
6-20-2018: Binge watched my first TV show in Chinese. I've also been going to Taiji every day and my brain is starting to produce mandarin quicker and more often than English. Often times the mandarin will pop into my head in the middle of an English sentence, sometimes before the English, and sometimes at the same time as the English. Very interesting.
3 Years 11 Months (Aug 2018)
8-27-2018:
Still chugging through the traditional characters and all the pronunciations.
On returning to China I feel like I can read and listen to anything with no
problems (people are still slowing down for me in actuality but it all feels
almost too easy). Time to start hitting the books and novels and TV shows to
take this stuff to the last level, native.
4 Years (Sept 2018)
4 Years (Sept 2018)
9-19-2018: So
today is the last day for learning the 3000 most common traditional characters
as well as learning/reviewing pronunciation for all of them. By some wild
guess, I decided to look today to see how much I had left and it turns out
today I had 25 words left. Pretty cool. Watching TV nowadays feels like I know
99.9% of the characters though the speed is still too quick sometimes to hear
everything.
4 Years 1 Month (Oct 2018)
4 Years 1 Month (Oct 2018)
10-3-2018:
I've been watching a fair amount of romantic dramas recently (2 hours +/day)
and the conversational flow of most dialogue has really helped a lot in making
my language flow more naturally. I was in the China Mobile store today and for
the first time, my brain grasping the flow and rhythm of the conversation
wanted to just starting talking even though I had no idea what was going to
come out. My usual "speak slowly and watch my tones" was way too
slow. When I am typing now and speak in English, it is the same way except I
assume what I am saying is correct since I have been corrected so many times in
the past. Wondering if I should just let go and see what happens.
10-12-2018: 如果他真的爱你的话 I saw this phrase and heard it simultaneously and I think it is the first time I've heard a whole sentence like this and immediately felt the weight of the words being said. The vocabulary and grammar is so familiar it was like hearing English almost. Very interesting.
4 Years 2 Months (Nov 2018)
10-12-2018: 如果他真的爱你的话 I saw this phrase and heard it simultaneously and I think it is the first time I've heard a whole sentence like this and immediately felt the weight of the words being said. The vocabulary and grammar is so familiar it was like hearing English almost. Very interesting.
4 Years 2 Months (Nov 2018)
11-3-2018：Just had an interesting experience where
watching TV and not understanding most of what is said but still grasping ideas
through context and key words. 26 years of learning about the world (in this
case about silicon valley) was enough to understand meaning even when I don't
understand a phrase.
I can now eat and watch TV and that is a huge milestone. Learning the language is at the easy/fun part which is very cool.
11-9-2018: My singing voice has been a little more tired than usual the last two weeks or so. I think it is due to an increased amount of mimicking as I watch TV recently. Yesterday I literally spent the entire day watching TV. I find that some sentences and phrases still sound awkward when I say them (when I pronounce them with the correct tones they don't sound like they do when spoken by native speakers). Sometimes I can also feel that my throat and mouth can't keep up and so I have to pronounce it many times over before it starts to sound natural.
11-19-2018: It's weird I can understand everything that is happening in a TV show. Sure, I miss connotation, all sorts of idioms, subtle plot twists, and the like…but 90% of the experience I can understand (between subtitles and listening). It’s weird how the brain at one point was wishing to just be able to get the gist of stuff. But as soon as that happens the brain is already longing after something else.
4 Years 3 Months (Dec 2018)
I can now eat and watch TV and that is a huge milestone. Learning the language is at the easy/fun part which is very cool.
11-9-2018: My singing voice has been a little more tired than usual the last two weeks or so. I think it is due to an increased amount of mimicking as I watch TV recently. Yesterday I literally spent the entire day watching TV. I find that some sentences and phrases still sound awkward when I say them (when I pronounce them with the correct tones they don't sound like they do when spoken by native speakers). Sometimes I can also feel that my throat and mouth can't keep up and so I have to pronounce it many times over before it starts to sound natural.
11-19-2018: It's weird I can understand everything that is happening in a TV show. Sure, I miss connotation, all sorts of idioms, subtle plot twists, and the like…but 90% of the experience I can understand (between subtitles and listening). It’s weird how the brain at one point was wishing to just be able to get the gist of stuff. But as soon as that happens the brain is already longing after something else.
4 Years 3 Months (Dec 2018)
12-5-2018:
Still haven't found a way to stop doubting that I'm making progress. I know it’s
important to constantly check but at the same time it seems a bit silly at
times. Was reading some things in Chinese recently and found that my flow and
sentence cadence has come a long way. Maybe by the end of this year I'll be
able to speed read Chinese? Probably not
4 Years 6 Months (Mar 2019)
3-21-2019: For the last two months or so I've been listening to the radio to add listening. It's kind of amazing to understand what is going on without subtitles and especially knowing where I started.
Just started watching a few anime dubbed into mandarin with no subtitles and while it was impossible to understand last year, I can get 80-90% now which is pretty amazing.
I picked up a book and read a few articles on my phone recently and the inner voice improvement is also kinda insane. I can read and flow without wondering about tones too much (though there are still quite a few with more than one pronunciation that still trips me up).
3-21-2019: For the last two months or so I've been listening to the radio to add listening. It's kind of amazing to understand what is going on without subtitles and especially knowing where I started.
Just started watching a few anime dubbed into mandarin with no subtitles and while it was impossible to understand last year, I can get 80-90% now which is pretty amazing.
I picked up a book and read a few articles on my phone recently and the inner voice improvement is also kinda insane. I can read and flow without wondering about tones too much (though there are still quite a few with more than one pronunciation that still trips me up).
4 Years 8 Months (May 2019)
5-1-2019：Just looked up the difference between 受 and 授 on Baidu and was reading explanation in mandarin. I could read the sentences with easy pronunciation just like looking up an answer on google. Pretty cool. My voice has been tired for the last month or so but my mandarin pronunciation has reached a new level of ease and native quality. Singing voice is still shot though.
5-5-2019: Was reading an article on Tencent news and could hear the cadence of the sentences (which were all characters I have heard and seen) super easy. I was able to see the chunks of words that make up a sentence, look ahead a bit, and actually read it with natural rhythm (of which I made a recording).
5-7-2019: Went to watch an episode of Detective Conan and can understand everything (the show doesn't have subtitles). Pretty neat.
5-1-2019：Just looked up the difference between 受 and 授 on Baidu and was reading explanation in mandarin. I could read the sentences with easy pronunciation just like looking up an answer on google. Pretty cool. My voice has been tired for the last month or so but my mandarin pronunciation has reached a new level of ease and native quality. Singing voice is still shot though.
5-5-2019: Was reading an article on Tencent news and could hear the cadence of the sentences (which were all characters I have heard and seen) super easy. I was able to see the chunks of words that make up a sentence, look ahead a bit, and actually read it with natural rhythm (of which I made a recording).
5-7-2019: Went to watch an episode of Detective Conan and can understand everything (the show doesn't have subtitles). Pretty neat.
5 Year (Sept 2019)
9-1-2019: I've been back in China for a week and haven't encountered any situations yet where I don't understand something or can't express what I want to say. I'm about to start watching TV again today. Thinking about paying someone to do a language session with me on a weekly basis to speed things up.
9-5-2019: I can finally say my phone number in Mandarin with no problems. Reciting a phone number is a very unique and interesting use of the brain. It feels like part muscle memory, part vision, and part language.
I kinda feel like I'm in a dangerous place where my Mandarin is "just good enough". I experience less times where my language is insufficient so I have less reminders to study. I would say that I have experienced this with a lot of my goals recently and realize that I'm entering a different sort of stage where my motivation come not from being so terrible it hurts but so close to success that I need to keep pushing.
9-1-2019: I've been back in China for a week and haven't encountered any situations yet where I don't understand something or can't express what I want to say. I'm about to start watching TV again today. Thinking about paying someone to do a language session with me on a weekly basis to speed things up.
9-5-2019: I can finally say my phone number in Mandarin with no problems. Reciting a phone number is a very unique and interesting use of the brain. It feels like part muscle memory, part vision, and part language.
I kinda feel like I'm in a dangerous place where my Mandarin is "just good enough". I experience less times where my language is insufficient so I have less reminders to study. I would say that I have experienced this with a lot of my goals recently and realize that I'm entering a different sort of stage where my motivation come not from being so terrible it hurts but so close to success that I need to keep pushing.
5 Years 6 Months (Mar 2019)
1-6-2020
As I expected
this timeline has been updated with a lot less frequency. Within this last year
my routine has been incredibly simple. I watch TV everyday with subtitles
enabled. I spend a few minutes on Anki going over traditional characters and
tone pronunciations. And that’s it. I know I’m making progress but it has
settled into such a barely there hum, that sometimes I forget everything I did
to get to this point.
Miscellaneous Notes
- Traditional Hanzi is pretty easy. I completely forgot that was a study goal at one point.
- I often still skip reading Chinese characters even though I can read and/or understand 99% of modern text (news, chat, billboards).
- I still do Anki every day and most times it’s not even conscious. It’s like breathing and takes all of 3 minutes.
- My voice is rarely fatigued from Chinese pronunciation practice.
- I don’t have any goals for 2020 except HSK 6 and watching more television.
Wednesday, February 14, 2018
Three Years Later: What is still difficult?
I wrote a post at the two year mark about things that are still surprisingly hard. Many of those things haven't changed much in the last year. Here are a few more things that still baffle me, almost three and half years into my Mandarin learning journey:
Telephone Numbers and Large Numbers
Recalling my phone number in Chinese is still quite a mental effort. I still try to recall the number from "sight" by seeing it in my head and translating those numbers to Mandarin instead of trusting my gut and speaking the sounds from aural memory. Large numbers like 一千五百万 and 24亿 are still difficult to translate into English quickly. Going from English to Mandarin is also quite the mental feat.
Chinese Dictionaries
The Kindle (or any e-book reader) is an amazing device for the language learner. Just a quick tap and you can learn pronunciations and definitions without barely breaking the flow of reading. I recently switched my Kindle into Mandarin and was pleasantly surprised to find that a Chinese dictionary (definitions of Chinese words in Chinese) suddenly became available. My success rate with understanding the definition is about 60-70% as many times the definition contains the very character I am trying to understand (this just might be a Kindle dictionary problem).
HSK 6 Content
I recently checked out a sample HSK 6 test. My reading speed has increased dramatically but still feels a tad too slow. I'm confident in my ability to produce Mandarin but producing intelligent-sounding Mandarin with good grammar still feels some ways off. Listening was quite difficult still. I understand the gist most times but often miss a key detail that would cause me to answer incorrectly. The audio provided for the sample test is also not the clearest. Here is an example:
I was easily able to understand passage #8 about travel during the spring holiday but when listening to passage #9 completely missed the first sentence (audio quality, lost focus, or other) which completely ruined my chance of understanding the rest of the passage. Despite knowing all of the words and easily being able to hear and understand them, this still gives me a bit of trouble. (Reading both of these passages is a piece of cake.)
Specialty Content
Reading Chinese is quite easy, maybe even easier than learning to read English. While English does have prefixes, suffixes, and root words that often given clues about the meaning of the word, it's very rare that a Chinese word does not contain a character that I am already familiar with. When it comes to listening however, especially with content that is specialized (physics, sports jargon, cooking terminology, etc.), things get a bit trickier. Learning specialized vocabulary makes me realize just how large my English vocabulary really is and how far I still have to go with my Mandarin.
Video Games
I suppose this falls under the later category. I thought I might be able to enhance my exposure to native conversation by gaming and chatting in Chinese. I couldn't get past the training stage in either StarCraft or League of Legends.
Singing and Song Lyrics
I tried to learn a Chinese song about a year ago. Some time after learning that song I noticed that I was mispronouncing a few different words on different occasions. It took me a minute to realize that I had picked up incorrect tones from learning that song. From what I can tell, the tones are most times (if at all) not retained when Mandarin is sung. This presents quite the challenge for the language learner who is trying to cement good pronunciation habits into their subconscious.
*Small talk, Phone Conversations, Handwritten Chinese, Advertisements
Many of these are still quite difficult. When audio quality or writing quality deteriorates, understanding language quickly becomes a game of probability. The more Mandarin you know, the better guess you can make as to what words/characters you missed. Everything is shorthand with these four and its all about the best educated guess.
Telephone Numbers and Large Numbers
Recalling my phone number in Chinese is still quite a mental effort. I still try to recall the number from "sight" by seeing it in my head and translating those numbers to Mandarin instead of trusting my gut and speaking the sounds from aural memory. Large numbers like 一千五百万 and 24亿 are still difficult to translate into English quickly. Going from English to Mandarin is also quite the mental feat.
Chinese Dictionaries
The Kindle (or any e-book reader) is an amazing device for the language learner. Just a quick tap and you can learn pronunciations and definitions without barely breaking the flow of reading. I recently switched my Kindle into Mandarin and was pleasantly surprised to find that a Chinese dictionary (definitions of Chinese words in Chinese) suddenly became available. My success rate with understanding the definition is about 60-70% as many times the definition contains the very character I am trying to understand (this just might be a Kindle dictionary problem).
HSK 6 Content
I recently checked out a sample HSK 6 test. My reading speed has increased dramatically but still feels a tad too slow. I'm confident in my ability to produce Mandarin but producing intelligent-sounding Mandarin with good grammar still feels some ways off. Listening was quite difficult still. I understand the gist most times but often miss a key detail that would cause me to answer incorrectly. The audio provided for the sample test is also not the clearest. Here is an example:
8
快到春节了，常常听到“春运”这个词，“春运”是什么意思呢？“春”
就是指中国最传统的节日“春节”；“运”就是指“运输”。“春运”就是
指春节期间的运输，主要包括火车、飞机、汽车等交通工具的运输情况。
9
一对夫妻吵架后好几天都不说话。这天，丈夫想和妻子说话，可妻子不理他。丈夫于是在家里到处乱翻。妻子最后忍不住了：“你到底找什么呀！”“谢天谢地，”丈夫高兴地说，“终于找到你的声音了。
I was easily able to understand passage #8 about travel during the spring holiday but when listening to passage #9 completely missed the first sentence (audio quality, lost focus, or other) which completely ruined my chance of understanding the rest of the passage. Despite knowing all of the words and easily being able to hear and understand them, this still gives me a bit of trouble. (Reading both of these passages is a piece of cake.)
Specialty Content
Reading Chinese is quite easy, maybe even easier than learning to read English. While English does have prefixes, suffixes, and root words that often given clues about the meaning of the word, it's very rare that a Chinese word does not contain a character that I am already familiar with. When it comes to listening however, especially with content that is specialized (physics, sports jargon, cooking terminology, etc.), things get a bit trickier. Learning specialized vocabulary makes me realize just how large my English vocabulary really is and how far I still have to go with my Mandarin.
Video Games
I suppose this falls under the later category. I thought I might be able to enhance my exposure to native conversation by gaming and chatting in Chinese. I couldn't get past the training stage in either StarCraft or League of Legends.
Singing and Song Lyrics
I tried to learn a Chinese song about a year ago. Some time after learning that song I noticed that I was mispronouncing a few different words on different occasions. It took me a minute to realize that I had picked up incorrect tones from learning that song. From what I can tell, the tones are most times (if at all) not retained when Mandarin is sung. This presents quite the challenge for the language learner who is trying to cement good pronunciation habits into their subconscious.
*Small talk, Phone Conversations, Handwritten Chinese, Advertisements
Many of these are still quite difficult. When audio quality or writing quality deteriorates, understanding language quickly becomes a game of probability. The more Mandarin you know, the better guess you can make as to what words/characters you missed. Everything is shorthand with these four and its all about the best educated guess.
Subscribe to:
Posts (Atom)