1) Names
Believe it or not, something as simple as names are quite hard to learn. Speaking and listening isn't too bad but the character set for names is very different than the characters used in normal speech and writing. This works great when reading because you immediately know you are reading a name or a transliteration. It's not great when you just want to mention someone's name in a brief WeChat message and you spend 10 minutes trying to find out what the stroke order is, how to pronounce it, or how to get the darn Chinese input to display the rare character you need.
If someone writes an address, recipe, or any sort of quick note for you; expect something like cursive or running script. My address on my apartment contract was incorrect and I didn't realize it for an entire month until I was standing in the police station being told I couldn't register. Nonetheless, it took an entire extra week to sort out the mess, all thanks to Handwritten Chinese! And I can't really blame em'. Who wants to spend a minute per character everytime you want to put something down in ink?
3) Small talk
Those couple of minutes waiting for and riding the elevator, standing at the counter waiting for an order, or the random person who starts a convo at the bus stop. It doesn't matter where in the world you are, it seems inescapable. For the language learner, it's a real test of skill. All the shorthand, idioms, and language oddities spring forth as you only have a few words, so they ought to be meaningful, right?
4) Advertisements
I could swear I'm partially fluent up and down and all day long, but play a TV or radio ad (even with transcript) and I'd fail like 75% of the time. Just like small talk, time is important and no word is wasted. When I think about commercials back home and not only just how little sense they usually make, but how many cultural references and play on words are included; I think I can confidently put Advertisements somewhere in the super native-level advanced learner category.
4) Song lyrics/Poems
I can hardly decipher these in my mother tongue, so maybe this one isn't too surprising.
I will be adding to this post as more come to mind. To be continued...
It's been two years (2 years!) and I decided a refresh was sorely needed. My web design skills, however, are quite lacking so I made do with the limited skill set and time contraints. The title still feels really cheezy but maybe in a good way?
Original 2015 Design (nativemand.blogspot.com)
New and Improved? 2016 Design (2years2native.blogspot.com)
Have any problems with the new look? Leave a comment below!
Hi all! I'm back! This is year two. I decided once again to read some passages to demonstrate my speaking ability. Why read to demonstrate speaking ability? Conversation (which I also demonstrate in the video) makes pronunciation more difficult as you also have to think about vocabulary, grammar, and sentence tone. Reading allows me to focus entirely on enunciating and showing off what I've accomplished in this last year.
For the first reading, I read the characters and for the poem, I used the pinyin. As you can see, there isn't any difference as my reading speed has improved tremendously. I tried not to practice reading these passages too much before making this vid. I listened to the audio twice for each and did about three takes for each as well.
I could've practiced it a bit more but I wanted it to reflect more of an average performance and not my absolute best. Why? Watching my older video, I realized there isn't much difference between the old and the new. This is in part because I practiced much more before recording and spoke more quickly. I think this isn't as accurate of a representation of my day-to-day speaking ability. So this vid is a bit more spontaneous. And hopefully, if I make another video a year from now, my progress will come across a little clearer.
Enjoy!
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Q&A
How much do I study per day?
I study at least an hour a day and sometimes as much as 2 to 3 hours. From September 2015 to June 2016 I was still enrolled as a student at the local university and studied full time there. As mentioned below, during the second semester, I largely skipped class to study on my own however.
What do I study each day?
I try to balance it between the four main areas (reading, writing, speaking, and listening). I usually do about an hour of Anki a day to increase vocabulary and pronunciation which is great for reading ability. I usually watch two episodes of a TV show (usually kid shows) which is 40 minutes. Usually one show has subtitles （more reading and pronunciation practice) and one show doesn't (emphasizes listening). Starting this fall, I also started writing a post to put on Lang-8
every other day. Usually writing a post takes about an hour (additional time to correct other users' entries). I've also started reading books and news articles as much as possible. (This wasn't really possible before finishing the HSK anki deck.) I also live in China and regularly practice speaking with students, their parents, and my Taiji instructor; not to mention all of the daily exposure.
How do I stay motivated?
During the school year, it was easy to stay motivated because my scholarship was dependent on performance. After graduating, I'm driven mostly by curiousity and appreciation for the language. I didn't really know when I first started studying, but my interest in learning the language is quite deep and even two years later I'm still thoroughly enjoying the entire process of becoming fluent.
One of the great things about Anki is that trying to skip a day is pretty hard. Missed days come back to bite rather quickly and painfully. When I was studying the HSK 6 deck (25 new words a day), skipping a day meant that I would have nearly double the amount of work the next day. I think I missed only one or two days the entire four and half months of studying.
I know this is a blog about pronunciation but what about your reading, writing, and listening abilities?
Keep an eye out for a new post! I plan to do a sample HSK 6 test soon. I think this is a great standardized way to show where listening and reading comprehension are. My speaking and writing are at about the same level. As mentioned previously, I am hoping that all the listening and reading ability I have developed (over the last two years) will allow me to absorb a lot of native Mandarin this year and really polish off my speaking and writing. In terms of writing characters, I know the most common 3000, and around 5000 words (some passive, some active). I live in Mainland China, so those figures are for simplified characters. If I get time, I definitely want to learn how to read traditional as well!
Your blog title tho'?
Well you're going to make up your mind regardless of what I think, right? When I first started out I didn't understand that pronunciation was multi-faceted. The difference between reading and speaking is significant. Grammar, vocabulary, speed, and length of a dialogue also vastly affect fluency and pronunciation from sentence to sentence. So I succeeded in some ways and failed in others.
If I speak slowly and really focus on pronunciation, it is very close to native. If I'm trying to communicate in day-to-day conversations, my "fluency" is all over the place. When I first started learning Mandarin, I imagined that after two years, I'd be easily talking in Chinese about whatever topic I wanted, maybe pausing to figure out an odd idiom or cultural reference. But being here at the two year mark, I'm both really happy with my progress and completely surprised at just how much I still have to learn to speak effortlessly at native level.
I think my biggest weakness right now is grammar. I've never
particularly enjoyed that part of language learning and I'm trying this
year to put some more effort into that area. I've also put almost all my
effort into reading and listening first so that I can pick up on
grammar naturally from massive input rather than workbook excercises.
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Timeline
Below are my diary entries from the last year. I've tried to clean up the grammar, punctuation and clarity a bit but time contraints mean that it will still very much sound like rushed journal entries.
1 Year 1 Month (Oct 2015)
Week
2 – Another noticeable leap in listening ability. I
feel like I can sit back and understand the teacher without having to strain to
pick up the meaning.
Week
3 – Just noticed that tone Sandhi is starting to
become subconscious. As reading becomes more of a involuntary task, my
conscious mind can skip ahead and stay on the lookout for upcoming tone
changes.
1 Year 2 Months (Nov 2015)
Week
1 – I am finally at a point where reading simple
books (children's books and textbooks made for learners) is possible. I never
would have imagined it would take so long to get to this point. Really feels
like I can read Chinese which is a surreal experience.
Week
2 – While recording video for my first set of blog
posts, I realized that I can hear the mistakes in my own pronunciation quite
clearly. Words like 故事 and 事故 which I felt for a long time were just about the same, seem like worlds
apart now.
Week
3 - Just had a really cool experience
"reading" Chinese for the first time. I'm still trying to understand
why it felt this way. One of the reasons is I can now read for extended periods
without encountering an unknown character. Not only that but I can also hear
the "speaking voice" in my head the same as when I read English. I
also now possess the very awesome ability of skimming a passage and
understanding the general outline. Very, very cool. Brings back memories of
being in elementary school and learning to read in English.
1 Year 3 Months (Dec 2015)
Week
2 - Just reached another milestone in
pronunciation. I can speak the phonemes and tones with a sense of ease. I am
trying to think of things that are comparable. The first thing that comes to
mind is learning a martial arts punch (or kick). You try over and over and over
again. Suddenly it just feels effortless and smooth. There is a certain
efficiency to the action like watching the movement of an animal or a
world-class athlete (not that my pronunciation is yet at this level).
I know 1400 characters according to the
WordSwing estimate after testing 80 characters.
1 Year 4 Months (Jan 2016)
Week
1 – Realized that my listening just experienced
another discreet jump. I can hear word groups now and not just a string of
unrelated characters.
Week
3 - It only took one look at the 催 character
and I could remember it. Person, mountain, who? and it was locked in.
(2016-11-9 I now see this as person, mountain, bird or ren, shan, niao)
1 Year 5 Months (Feb 2016)
Week
1 – I've started the HSK deck (referenced
previously on the blog) and it's absolutely amazing to be at this point in
learning Chinese. It has pictures, audio, and I can fly through the cards which
is even more motivating. It's like a fun game especially since I don't have to remember all
the strokes (I am not using the deck for practicing writing Hanzi). The sample
sentences also help with additional vocab acquisition, pronunciation, and
memory recall.
Week
2 - I've been consistently doing about an hour of
Anki a day. The new HSK deck is doing wonders and it's so fun to get new cards
and know that I am absorbing huge chunks of new vocab that I will see
everywhere. Can't wait to start reading after I get through this deck. Should
be a cinch.
Second tone still feels really awkward
after a year and a half of study. Putting emphasis on hearing it and
enunciating it properly.
Week
3 – I am starting to subconsciously recognize word
formation. I saw 假装 jiǎzhuāng and I knew right away that the first character didn't feel right
with a fourth tone but must be a 3rd tone like in 假如.
1
Year 6 Months (Mar 2016)
Week
1 - So many characters that I've seen for more than
a year and a half are finally being discovered and put into long-term memory.
I've continued a constant assault on the
Anki deck and just did another HSK quick test. I got 1800. It feels like I know
close to 2000 characters which is 2/5 of the 5000 most common words needed
to get HSK 6. That puts me at 40% and that sounds about right when I'm watching
Detective Conan. Speaking of which, I was able to understand like 70% of the
last episode I watched which was really neat (of course, there are also
episodes where I understand like 30%).
Week
2 – Some of the stories, articles, and passages
that I excerpted for my Anki deck are starting to fade from my memory. As
mentioned in my previous timeline post, context is an important part of memory
but not infallible.
Had my first successful phone call
yesterday. This probably seems pretty mundane but conversation without being
able to see the other person is incredibly challenging. I called the power company,
navigated the self-serve menu and successfully got the password to check my
bill history. Very specific vocabulary and low quality audio are a language
learner's nightmare (or favorite way to practice).
I don't really participate that much in
class. Since starting the second year, I've fallen from number one in the class
to what feels like somewhere right in the middle or lower. I don't even bother
asking questions because more likely than not, I have no idea what the
teacher's response is. The skill level among students isn't really well
balanced. I'm also partially to blame because I avoid doing most of the
homework and class activities (opting instead to use my own study methods).
1 Year 7 Months (Apr 2016)
Week
1 – It's still pretty difficult to read characters
at the same rate that I can hear and understand them.
Walking into a KFC or McDonalds is no
longer an overwhelming experience. I attribute this to all the new characters
I've learned. It reminds me of a when I first starting learning Chinese and
just going to a webpage in Mandarin was headache-inducing. A few months in, and
even though I still couldn't understand a thing on a webpage in Chinese, it
doesn't seem all that daunting.
Week
2 – Pronunciation has improved again. Speaking
feels easier and sounds much cleaner. (reading this in Nov. 2016 I wish I had
provided more details about what feels different. I guess at the very least,
these discrete jumps are timestamped and maybe a review of this timeline will
reveal some sort of regular time pattern as to when to expect a jump in
progress).
Week
3 - I have a serious case of senioritis. I could
care less for all the classes and I've been spending huge amounts of class time
in the library or at home studying solo.
I saw 联系 and had no problem
knowing how to pronounce it. I knew both characters individually so there was
no need to recall 练习 and try to remember which was which. Knowing individual characters
is quite helpful.
1 Year 8 Months (May 2016)
Week
1 – I finally started studying Taiji this semester
and have been going to the class for foreign students and the later class just
for Chinese students. Has been a great way to practice speaking Mandarin and
listening to a strong accent (the teacher is from Anhui).
Week
2- Reading 蛋白质 felt as easy as reading English. I know all the individual
characters so it is just a matter of “sounding out” the word. Very neat.
Another discrete jump in listening ability
occurred. I can now hear the "flow" and "pitch" of the
language. I don't have to strain and consciously put forth effort to hear the
tones and tone changes. It's not perfect or native level but it feels like the
moment I have been waiting for, for a long, long time.
Second tone has also suddenly gotten easier
to pronounce and a lot of the previous vocal effort that was required is no
longer needed.
Week
3 – It feels like I've finished learning Chinese.
It's not really true in the slightest but right now I'm just learning new
words. I think this false sense of completion has to do with having seen a
majority of the grammar structures that Chinese has to offer.
1 Year 9 Months (Jun 2016)
Week
1 – Put my computer into Chinese mode. I promised
myself (back in 2014 before arriving in China) that I would change the language
option in my computer and phone upon arriving. Never would've guessed it would
actually be 2016 by time I could do this.
Week
2 - I've been missing a lot of words lately. Can't
tell if it's memory fatigue (after three months of 25 new words a day), brain
fatigue (wrong time of day), or just lots of new words that all have similar
characters. Or maybe I'm close to the finish line and I'm psyching myself out.
Week
3 – Another jump in pronunciation ability.
Started with another language partner after
feeling like my speaking level is lagging behind pretty bad.
1
Year 10 Months (Jul 2016)
Week
1 - This is what I posted to my blog:
I'm not even sure the exact date when I
started (sometime in February) but I'm completely finished the HSK 6 deck
(linked previously as the Timo Deck). That's a total of 5000 words, 2663
characters, some odd idioms, and who knows what else. I can't actively use
those words in speaking or writing and I don't know how to write a few of those
characters but the effect is noticeable.
Week
2 – All the new HSK words are everywhere. The great
thing about vocab decks sorted by frequency is that you immediately use and see
them everywhere. It's an excellent motivation to keep at the Anki decks day in
and out. It's easy to remember pronunciation now that I know lots of words. And
my much larger web (or mud wall) has made learning new Mandarin that much
easier.
Week
3 – I am at a point where I want to use native
sounding phrases and sentences structures. I don't just want to communicate
(which is a big milestone in and of itself). My listening has improved yet
again.
1
Year 11 Months (Aug 2016)
I am back in the US to visit family. I
don't really do much studying during this time. I just put in about a half an
hour each day doing review cards from the HSK deck
Week 3 – Starting to feel deeper nuances by
studying same HSK deck. Small changes in pitch and cadence that give native
speakers their distinct sound are becoming more apparent.
2 Years!! (Sept 2016)
Week
1 – I am focusing less on learning new words and
more on listening more closely during Anki study.
Week
2 - Speaking and listening feel so easy after
having returned to China. Maybe time off really allowed my neurons to recharge
and rearrange into more efficient patterns. Things I've noticed:
Reading feels so easy on webpages and
chatrooms.
I can now learn new concepts just by
listening during conversation.
I can now make out key words quite well. Even
if I only understand 30%, I can still respond with an appropriate question or
answer that allows the conversation to continue. This also allows me to get another
chance at hearing something I do fully understand.
2 Years 1 Month (Oct 2016)
Week
1 – Wasn't looking forward to starting a writing
Hanzi deck. The most common 3000 Hanzi is not at all like my home-made deck
(multiple new words per card). A character per card is almost too easy. I
started about three days ago and I reversed the deck so I'll be seeing lots of
new characters as soon as possible.
I also started the “8000 Chinese Sentences”
deck to continue practicing pronunciation. I'm finally at a place where I am
learning the smaller nuances like in a sentence "她爱干净“ between
the first two characters there is no space, just a continuing vowel. Phrases
like "大家”(fourth and first tone) still feels like a tongue-twister and I
really have to consciously enunciate the tones on it.
Learning Chinese finally feels easy. A bit
like learning Spanish in high school, everything looks and feels pretty
familiar now. Getting to learn all the nonessential but concrete words like
spider and whale. Characters and components are super familiar.
Week
2 – Watching a kids cartoon show is quite easy. The
characters look really simple (compared to the characters I'm studying currently)
and I can understand probably 85-95% of most episodes. Pretty cool. The Hanzi
Anki deck has had a remarkable effect in a very short amount of time.
Week
3 – Right now, pronunciation feels like a
gymnastics exercise. Most of my single and double tone production is pretty
good so now it is sentence work and feeling tone and flow. Every sentence feels
like a tone tongue twister (say that five fimes fast) when spoken at native
level.
Today I caught myself mid-sentence talking
to my Taiji instructor over dinner. For the first time I was thinking only
about the subject matter and nothing about the language that we were useing to
communicate. It was a really surreal moment.
I also just finished submitting a diary
entry to Lang-8. As I got up to go do something else I started my inner
dialogue about what to do with the remaining two hours of the day and...Chinese
came out. I thought "我要" instead of “I want”. Despite how simple the phrase was and
how short the moment lasted, it really cemented the progress in these last two
year.
I was trying to explain 微观 and 宏观 to my 8th
grade student and I realized that she hadn't seen these words before.
Interesting to see that my vocabulary is finally starting to supersede middle
school level. It also reminds me that native speakers aren't omniscient in
their mother tongue. I'm getting to a point where I should probably stop
putting the majority of the burden on myself when there is a misunderstanding. A
natural part of conversation is asking questions to get something clarified.
I am starting to use Baidu translation
differently. Before, I would grab a sample sentence at random and hope that it
would work in my particular case. Now I can differentiate the different
synonyms based on the sentence's context and choose something that is correct
the majority of the time (probably above 70% for the simple stuff).
I think it's fair to say it's been a good
last month for this two-year journey.
Is it over? Nope. I've just started year
three and maybe there will even be posts here in 2018…we'll see.
I'm not even sure the exact date when I started (sometime in February) but I'm completely finished the HSK 6 deck (linked previously as the Timo Deck). That's a total of 5000 words, 2663 characters, some odd idioms, and who knows what else.
My reading is pretty decent, my pronunciation has improved tons, and it creates a wonderful base for building listening, writing, and speaking ability going forward.
It's been 25 new words a day, everyday for the last 4 and 1/2 months. In the last month, maybe it was just the psychological aspect of nearing the finish line, but words started slipping a lot and my review deck was as high as 300 cards a day plus the 25 new words. It took on average about 70-80 minutes, many times 90 minutes a day of just flash cards. But, now that I'm finally here, I can 100% say that it was worth it. Of course, I'm not completely done. Over the next few days/week I will still be studying the review cards that will slowly decrease to negligible amounts over the next week or so. Really excited for what comes next.
Now comes the fun part, massive input :D Three months to go before HSK 6!
This one is called "Most Common 3000 Hanzi" and can be found on Anki Shared Decks. I've been religiously going through Timo's HSK Deck and it's made my homemade deck pretty redundant (not too mention extremely boring). It's time for a slight shift in how I study.
With class becoming all but irrelevant with HSK 6 looming (not sure why we aren't prepping in class), I've been putting more and more effort into personal study time outside the textbooks. Anki makes up a large part of this. Going through 25 new words a day (about 200 words a week) means that the 50 new words per chapter are usually already known. I end up just putting words with new characters into my personal Anki deck. Not only that but the words in the HSK 6 list have a crazy amount of character redundancy.
There are 2600 characters in HSK 6 and 5000 words. Since each word has two characters that means the Hanzi repeat, A LOT. It makes more sense at this point to just learn the individual characters and remember which characters are in which words. This definitely would not have worked at the beginning (you need the context of the word to even remember the characters). But now that more than a year and a half of experiences and studying have cemented many of the concepts in place *deep breath* it's quite easy to just learn the most common words that are made up of the most common characters. It's kinda like an alphabet...that has several thousand letters. An added benefit of single character study is increased word comprehension, word composition, and a better understanding of etymology.
As usual, the picture above is a sample of what the Anki deck looks like. It has actual stroke animation built in! (courtesy of MDGB.net) My terrible Windows-Paint GIF above doesn't really do the animation right. All strokes and stroke directions are shown unlike the swipe effect above :D
**Skritter is fantastic resource (at least when I tried the demo) but I still ain't ready to fork over $100 a year for only a slightly-more-interactive experience. So for now I shall be sticking with free Anki...
